In this article, we explore the use of various matrix norms for optimizing functions of weight matrices, a crucial problem in deep learning. Moving beyond the spectral norm that underlies the Muon update, we leverage the duals of the Ky Fan norms to introduce the Fanion family of linear minimization oracle (LMO) algorithms, which are closely related to Muon, ν-SAM, and Dion. Staying inside the LMO, we construct the families of F-Fanions and S-Fanions, whose updates are convex combinations of the updates of Fanions and Normalized SGD or SignSGD, respectively. The most promising algorithms in these families are F-Muon and S-Muon. By conducting an extensive empirical study of all three algorithm families across a wide range of tasks and settings, we demonstrate that F-Muon and S-Muon consistently match Muon's performance, while outperforming Muon on a synthetic smooth convex problem.
Muon has recently emerged as a strong optimizer for large-scale deep learning, where it reshapes gradient updates through approximate orthogonalization and has been reported to outperform Adam and AdamW in large language model training. Its empirical success has motivated a growing body of theoretical work that interprets Muon as steepest descent under the spectral norm. Yet it remains unclear which of Muon's advantages stem from its update rule itself and which are artifacts of the scale, architecture, and data of modern deep networks. In this work, we isolate the optimizer from these confounding factors by studying Muon on a simple, well-understood, and spectrally structured problem: low-rank matrix factorization. Through a controlled comparison against carefully tuned adaptive baselines, we find that Muon does not consistently outperform AdamW in this setting and that several previously reported advantages are sensitive to hyperparameter choices. Our results provide a more nuanced picture of when spectrum-aware orthogonalization is beneficial and argue for evaluating modern optimizers on controlled problems in addition to end-to-end benchmarks.
We study Muon, a recently proposed matrix-aware optimization method, in the context of the Stiefel manifold. This manifold consists of matrices with orthonormal columns and is ubiquitous in machine learning and scientific computing. Existing extensions of Muon to this manifold rely on heuristic, approximate, or iterative updates with varying computational efficiency. We show that the corresponding Stiefel Muon update admits an exact closed-form solution and use this result to develop Skewon, a practical algorithm for orthogonality-constrained optimization with an efficient implementation. We further establish first-order convergence guarantees for Skewon in the smooth non-convex setting.
Muon and related norm-constrained matrix optimizers have become central to large-scale learning problems. They are formulated as a linear maximization oracle (LMO) over an ambient matrix-norm ball in unconstrained Euclidean space. However, these do not generalize cleanly to manifold-valued parameters such as low-rank factorizations, orthogonality constraints, or symmetric positive definite (SPD) matrices. Naively restricting the Muon LMO to the tangent space (i) breaks quotient symmetries and (ii) couples the tangent-space constraint with an ambient norm bound, thereby obstructing closed-form solutions on various manifolds of interest. We resolve both issues with a single observation: every Riemannian metric canonically lifts a unitarily invariant Euclidean norm to an intrinsic norm on each tangent space, and the resulting intrinsic norm constrained LMO is symmetry preserving. Building on this, we introduce intrinsic Muon (iMuon), a unified framework that yields closed-form updates on the fixed-rank, SPD, Stiefel, and Grassmann manifolds for any unitarily invariant norm, including the spectral, Frobenius, and nuclear norms. We establish convergence guarantees for both deterministic and stochastic iMuon with rate constants that depend only on the manifold dimension. Notably, on the fixed-rank manifold this constant depends only on the rank, making the rate independent of factor conditioning and removing the runtime factor-rescaling required by prior work. Experiments on LoRA finetuning of LLMs, image classification, and subspace learning illustrate the efficacy of the proposed approach.