Optimizer-dependent training dynamics converge to the same one-third optimal data scaling
Authors: Hyunseok Lee, Mihir Basil, Yizhou Liu, Jeff Gore
Organizations: Department of Physics, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Cambridge, MA · Department of Physics, University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia, PA
Neural scaling, in which loss falls as a power law with training, is central to large language models, and one recent proposal is that a 1/3 exponent emerges from learning peaked distributions. That account describes SGD, but models in practice are trained with adaptive optimizers. Here we separate two exponents the 1/3 account does not distinguish: how fast the loss falls with training steps along a single run, and how fast the optimally tuned loss falls with dataset size D. We show that the first, a dynamic exponent, is optimizer-specific while the second, an optimal data exponent, converges to 1/3 across optimizers. In an online teacher-student model we decompose the loss into norm growth (radial) and alignment toward the teacher direction (tangential), each decaying as a power law with dynamic exponents αr and αt. Under SGD, both are close to 1/3, so the data exponent is also 1/3 across different learning rates. Under Adam the two separate: αr≃0.48 but αt≃0.08. Since the total loss is minimized when these two parts are balanced, the optimal learning rate is optimizer-dependent: D-independent for SGD but falls with D for Adam. Yet tuned to that optimum, the loss returns to D−1/3 for both. A stochastic-dynamics analysis explains why: the optimizers can trade decay speed between the two channels, but they all fall on a single dynamic exponent relation, 2αr+αt=1, which fixes the optimal data exponent at 1/3. Across seven optimizers, including Muon, the measured exponents are consistent with this relation, and the optimal-loss envelopes agree with D−1/3 across them. The optimizer sets how fast a model learns per step; tuned optimally, it changes the prefactor but not the rate at which loss falls per sample.
Figures & tables
Figure 1: Optimizers produce qualitatively different dynamics on the same task. Online teacher–student softmax classification with n=128 classes and input dimension m=32 , trained with SGD (top row, batch size B=256 ) and Adam (bottom row, batch size B=64 ). For each optimizer η and B are chosen so that the tangential loss stays positive and the norm growth remains drift-dominated (Appendix G ); the exponents do not depend on batch size for either optimizer (Figure 7 ), so the comparison is not affected by the choice. Color denotes learning rate η ; the two rows use different ranges, since the useful learning rates differ by roughly two decades between the optimizers. (a) Training dynamics of SGD follows 1/3 time scaling. Left: test loss L follows a single clean power law across the full range, with fitted exponent 0.34±0.01 . Right: weight norm β=∥WS∥F is consistent with β∼t1/3 (fitted 0.33±0.01 ). (b) Training dynamics of Adam deviates from 1/3 time scaling. Left: test loss curves bend over an extended transient and no single exponent describes the trajectory. Right: weight norm expands faster than t1/3 throughout (fitted 0.44±0.04 ).
Figure 2: The loss splits into a radial and a tangential component with distinct power-law dynamics and trade-offs between them. (a) Geometry of the decomposition. The student WS is compared to the rescaled teacher WR=βWT , which carries the student’s current norm but the teacher’s direction. The radial loss Lr=CE(p,pR) measures scale mismatch and the tangential loss Lt=L−Lr measures misalignment, which the restoring Hessian reduces and stochastic injection from mini-batch noise sustains. (b, c) Lr and Lt against training step, for SGD (top) and Adam (bottom), colored by learning rate over the same ranges as in Figure 1 . Both decay as power laws whose exponents are independent of the learning rate: αr=0.35±0.01 and αt=0.33±0.02 for SGD, αr=0.48±0.03 and αt=0.08±0.01 for Adam.
Figure 3: Optimal learning rate scales differently with B and D for SGD and Adam, but the optimal loss follows one-third data scaling for both. Learning-rate sweeps over 8 batch sizes B∈[16,2048] and 16 learning rates, spanning [10−3,10] for Adam and [10−1,103] for SGD, with D=Bt the number of online samples processed. In each panel the upper row is SGD and the lower row Adam. Slopes sB and sD quoted in (a) and (b) are from the joint log-log plane fit log10η∗=sDlog10D+sBlog10B+c described in Appendix H . (a) η∗ against D , one curve per batch size (grayscale). SGD’s optimum is nearly flat ( sD=−0.04±0.01 ), while Adam’s decreases ( sD=−0.35±0.01 ), close to −1/3 and to the recently reported “magic exponent” 0.32 ( Bjorck et al., 2024 ) . (b) η∗ against batch size, one curve per data size (color). SGD follows η∗∝B ( sB=1.01±0.01 ), while Adam gives sB=0.76±0.01 , steeper than the square-root rule of common practice and than the value reported for LLM training ( Ren et al., 2026 ) . (c) Test loss along the optimal- η envelope against D , with individual runs colored by training step and shaded by batch size. Both optimizers give the same optimal data scaling, L∗(D)∼D−1/3 , with fitted exponents αD=0.341±0.001 for SGD and 0.341±0.003 for Adam. The quoted exponent is the pooled estimate across batch sizes of Appendix H .4. The η∗ traces in (a) are visibly noisy at large D while the envelope in (c) is clean; Figure 5 shows the underlying sweeps and the flatness of the basin.
Figure 4: A sum rule for training exponents holds across optimizers, and fixes the optimal data-scaling exponent at 1/3 . (a) Measured radial and tangential time-scaling exponents, Lr∼t−αr and Lt∼t−αt , for SGD, the PowerAdam family A=V−a at a∈{0.125,0.25,0.375,0.5(Adam)} , Muon, and SignGD. Crosses give fit uncertainties. The dashed line is 2αr+αt=1 , a parameter-free prediction with no fitted quantities; the black point marks the a=0 prediction (1/3,1/3) . Adam sits at αr≃0.48 , above the nominal 2/5 , corresponding to an effective q≃0.9 ; Appendix G rules out two alternative explanations. (b) Optimal data-scaling exponent αD , with L∗(D)∼D−αD . Six of the seven lie within 2.5% of 1/3 , slightly above it by the finite-norm excess (Appendix H .4); SignGD approaches it from below over this window, its larger bar reflecting a longer transient rather than a different exponent (Appendix H .4). This follows from (a): minimizing over z gives αD=(2αr+αt)/3 , which equals 1/3 exactly on the line. Error bars are the spread across four lower fitting cutoffs (Appendix H ).
Appendix figures & tables10 assets
Supplementary material from the paper’s appendix.
Appendix
general
SGD ( q=0 )
Adam (nominal)
Adam (measured)
αr
1/(3−q)
1/3
2/5
0.48±0.03
αt
(1−q)/(3−q)
1/3
1/5
0.08±0.01
sD
−q/3
0
−1/6
−0.35±0.01
sB
1−p
1
1/2
0.76±0.01
αD
1/3
1/3
1/3
0.341±0.003
Appendix
Table 1: Predicted and measured exponents. Every nominal entry for Adam is displaced by the measurement, yet αD is unchanged: the measured αr corresponds to an effective q≃0.92 by inversion, and the measured sB to an effective p≃0.24 , a separation discussed in Section 5 . The final row is measured for all seven optimizers in Figure 4 b and Table 4 .
ν=0
ν=1
general ν
sum rule
2αr+αt=1
αr+αt=1
ν+12αr+αt=1
αD
1/3
1/2
(ν+1)/(ν+3)
Lr∗/Lt∗
2
1
2/(ν+1)
Appendix
Table 2: Effect of the margin density on the sum rule and the optimum. The exponents shift with ν , but none of these quantities depends on the optimizer.
optimizer
learning-rate range
SGD
[10−1,103]
PowerAdam( 0.125 )
[10−1,103]
PowerAdam( 0.25 )
[10−2,102]
PowerAdam( 0.375 )
[10−2,101]
Adam = PowerAdam( 0.5 )
[10−3,101]
Muon
[10−2.5,101]
Appendix
Table 3: Learning-rate sweep ranges, each with 16 logarithmically spaced values. The ranges shift downward as the preconditioner power increases, spanning six decades across the family; this is the unquantified form of the optimizer-dependence measured in Figure 3 .
Figure 5: The loss basin is broad and quadratic in logη . Total loss against learning rate for Adam, one point per swept learning rate, with grey level denoting batch size at a fixed training step. Red markers are the parabola vertices used as η∗ ; they fall between grid points because they are interpolated. Left: the full swept range. Right: the same data near the minimum, on a linear vertical axis. Two things are visible. The minima are interior to the swept range at every batch size, so the estimator never has to extrapolate to a grid edge. And the basin is flat: the loss changes little over a factor of several in η . Since the loss is quadratic in logη near its minimum, the location of the optimum is fixed only at second order while its value is fixed at first, which is why the η∗ traces in Figure 3 a are noisy at large D while the envelope in Figure 3 c is clean.
Dmin
Optimizer
105
3×105
106
3×106
αD
SGD
0.343
0.342
0.340
0.341
0.341±0.001
PowerAdam(0.125)
0.334
0.332
0.332
0.333
0.333±0.001
PowerAdam(0.25)
0.335
0.334
0.331
0.333
0.333±0.002
PowerAdam(0.375)
0.337
0.336
0.336
0.339
0.337±0.001
Adam
0.339
0.339
0.342
0.347
0.341±0.003
Appendix
Table 4: Envelope exponents against the lower fitting cutoff. αD fitted over D≥Dmin for four choices of Dmin , with the quoted value the mean across the four and the uncertainty their spread. The envelope is built from checkpoints with t≥103 , the same window used for the dynamic exponents αr and αt , so that all four exponents are fitted over matched data. The envelope is defined as the minimum of the loss over hyperparameters at each budget, as in Figure 3 c, with its exponent estimated by a pooled fit with a single slope in logD and one free level per batch size (Appendix H .4). Six of the seven lie within 2.5% of 1/3 , with a scatter across optimizers of 0.004 ; SignGD approaches 1/3 from below over this window, its per-batch-size envelope slopes, fitted separately, rising from 0.06 at B=16 to 0.33 at B=2048 , so the batch sizes that reach furthest into the asymptotic regime already give the family value. We stop at Dmin=3×106 because the number of batch sizes reaching a given budget falls as D grows: since each covers D∈[103B,104B] , fewer than three contribute above 5×106 and only one above 107 , so later cutoffs measure the largest batch sizes rather than a minimum over hyperparameters.
Figure 6: The radial loss is a function of the weight norm alone. Lr against β for SGD (left) and Adam (right), colored by learning rate over the ranges of Figure 1 . Curves at different learning rates collapse onto a single master curve approaching Lr∝β−1 (dashed). This tests Eq. ( 5 ) directly, without comparing two separately fitted exponents.
Figure 7: The channel exponents do not depend on batch size. Lr (left) and Lt (right) against training step for all eight batch sizes at fixed learning rate, SGD above and Adam below, with the exponents of Figure 2 shown as dashed guides. Batch size shifts the curves without changing their slopes, which together with Figure 2 establishes that αr and αt depend on neither hyperparameter. Larger batches lower Lt , while Lr is nearly batch-independent for SGD: at fixed step Lr depends on batch size only through Bp , and p=0 for SGD. At a fixed sample budget D=Bt the comparison changes sign, since a larger batch is less noisy and lowers Lt but buys fewer optimization steps and so leaves Lr higher. The erratic early-time behavior at small batch size is Lt<0 , the finite-norm transient described in Appendix B .
Figure 8: A dynamic exponent and a hyperparameter exponent are not independent. Measured sD against αr for all seven optimizers, with the prediction of Eq. ( 32 ) as a dashed curve and the SGD value (1/3,0) as a black point. The two axes come from independent measurements, αr from the loss curves and sD from the plane fit, so this test does not involve αt . The curve terminates at (1/2,−1/3) , the limit αt→0 or q→1 , beyond which the tangential channel no longer decays.
Figure 9: The two optimal-learning-rate exponents across optimizers. Measured sD against sB , with the SGD prediction (1,0) as a black point and the values reported by Ren et al. (2026) for their hypersphere optimizer as a star. Since sD=−q/3 and sB=1−p , the horizontal axis measures the preconditioner’s batch exponent and the vertical axis its scale exponent.
Figure 10: The two channels reach a fixed ratio at the optimum. Lt/L against z/z∗ for each of the seven optimizers, with z=ηBp−1 and z∗(D)=10cDsD taken from the plane fit of Appendix H . Each panel contains all 16 learning rates and all 8 batch sizes at five training times ( t≈300 , 1000 , 3000 , 5000 , 9000 ), and they collapse onto a single curve: Lt/L depends on the hyperparameters only through z/z∗ . Every optimizer passes through 1/3 at z=z∗ (dashed lines), as Theorem 2 predicts with no fitted quantity beyond the plane fit that sets z∗ . The collapse follows R/(1+R) with R=21(z/z∗)3αr ; deviations appear only for Lt/L≲0.1 , where Lt is a small difference of two larger quantities and the finite-norm transient of Appendix B can drive it negative.
Neural network training dynamics studies how parameters and representations change during optimization and how those changes shape learning, stability, and generalization.
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Vansh Ramani, Shourya Vir Jain
Department of Computer Science and Engineering, Indian Institute of Technology Delhi · Department of Electrical Engineering, Indian Institute of Technology Delhi
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Zaiwen Yang, Huaqing Zhang, Jing Xu +1
Tsinghua University · Tsinghua University, Shanghai Qi Zhi Institute
A recurring design principle in modern optimizers is to decouple update magnitude from the raw gradient norm, yet its consequences for learning-curve and resource scaling remain unclear. We isolate this mechanism by studying normalized SGD in a random-feature model with power-law teacher and data covariance. Fixed-norm updates induce an effective learning rate that grows as gradients shrink. We derive a dynamical mean-field theory (DMFT) describing the joint dependence of the loss on training time, model width and batch size. Normalization initially accelerates SGD, mapping the power-law exponent rSGD<1 to 2rSGD/(1−rSGD), with exponential convergence at rSGD=1 and formal finite-time convergence for rSGD>1. At finite step size, however, the same feedback ultimately breaks the acceleration and leads to marginal stability. The late-time theory yields width-limited, edge-of-stochastic-stability (EoSS), and deterministic edge-of-stability (EoS) regimes. These phases determine when larger batches or wider models reduce serial training time at comparable compute. We quantify in which of these phases increased batch size or width can compensate the excess compute use per step by fewer optimization steps to target loss. Linearized ResNet experiments on CIFAR-5M support the predicted acceleration, breakdown, and resource-scaling trends. Together, these results connect normalization-induced acceleration, EoS effects, and width--batch allocation within a solvable theory.
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John A. Paulson School of Engineering and Applied Sciences, Harvard University, Cambridge, MA · Center for Brain Science, Harvard University, Cambridge, MA · Kempner Institute for the Study of Natural and Artificial Intelligence, Harvard University, Cambridge, MA